Tuesday, 8 November 2011

On the issue of Seksualiti Merdeka : A response to Marina Mahathir

Salam to Sis Marina,

1. What majority of Malaysian are against is for us to tolerate and condone an immoral activity in a public sphere/forum. It has nothing to do with individual liberty or individual discrimination as I will point below.

2. Yes, Islam teaches us to be fair and just. However what is Haram is Haram and what is Halal is Halal. I agree that just because an individual is a homosexual we have no right to call them kafir, just as we have no right to call a person who cheats, steal and kill as kafir. This is because only God have the right to determine whether an individual has gone astray from the right path or not. I believe this was the key message from both Dr Tariq Ramadhan and the late Dr Fathi Osman.

3. You pointed out that there are homosexuals who are religious. I do not deny this just as I do not deny that there are gamblers, fraudster, drug abuser, alcoholics who also believes in God, fast in Ramadhan and pray 5 times a day.  Do we also need to question why don’t we give room for people indulging in these vices in Islam?  Also, it is wrong for you to equate the fight for women’s right to the homosexual movement. You are making it more difficult for us women to bring real changes by making this association. This maybe the natural strategy taken by LBGT activist in the West but it is wrong for us to follow it because it only makes things worse.

4. Please correct me if I am wrong, in our country, if an individual commit a murder, irrespective of his/her sexual preferences, that individual will be given the death penalty. In our country, you can buy houses, get loans, get employed at Governmental agencies irrespective of your sexual preferences. Honestly, have you ever heard of someone who was asked about their sexual preferences when he/she goes to a job interview in this country?

5. In our country, every individual has the right to do whatever he/she wants to inside his/her own property as long as it does not jeopardise or encroached the property of others i.e. the community. So if a Muslim wants to consume alcohol, eat roasted pork, gamble, and indulge in homosexuality and other vices in his/her own property, then it is their right and let God judge them (point 2). This is the basic concept of liberty and nobody is encroaching on this right i.e. PDRM do not come to your house to check if you engage in homosexual activities like they do in Iran, do they?

6. So what do we do now? Nobody can deny that there are homosexuals, bisexuals and lesbians in our community and denying their existence is futile. In my opinion (feel free to disagree with it), the best solution is for us to give the right kind of support.

7. Homosexuality is a behavioural disease (I know what proponents of LBGT will say so please spear me the details/attacks - I've heard them all before). Just like alcoholism and drug abuse, the individual must first admit to him/herself that he/she has a problem. You can change a child’s behaviour but not an adult. So what can the community do?

The right kind of support group - We have support group for alcoholics and drug abuser, why not for homosexuals? It may be highly controversial in the US or UK but Malaysia is a sovereign and independent country.

Take for example the support group for alcoholics, have you ever heard any of these groups say :

- Drink all you want, it is your right. Do not change but be proud that you are an alcoholic.


- You alcoholics are evildoers! You will be burn in hell and the alcohol you drink will be the gasoline that will burn you.

FYI, they don't say either. Same goes to support group for drug abuser. In the support group, they will help one another to get rid of their vices because changing behaviour is hard but it is possible!

8. Yes, there are individuals who go into rehab every 3-4 months without any success but you will never find anyone of a sane mind that will say "Just be who you are (drug abuser) and be proud of it!". I believe this is the right cure for our country in dealing with behavioural disease like homosexuality. I believe if this was the intention of the organiser of Seksualiti Merdeka, majority of Malaysian will support it.

9. To each its own. What works in country X may not work in country D. We have to come out with our own solution for our problem.

Salam from,
Fatimah Zuhri


  1. Agree with u 100%.. A support group will do good instead of allowing them to be one.. If there are any support group I don't mind to be the first one to register as a counselor voluntarily..

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  3. Please, I beg of you, do not speak merely from your high and unsighted place deep within your protected community but come out of your cocoon of self righteousness and actually speak to the people who are fighting for and are directly affected by these issues and rights. A jaunt near Petaling Street or Lorong Haji Taib doesn't qualify, in case you were wondering.

    Talk to those who have been discriminated and abused for how they look, act, speak or dress instead of making generalizations and jabbing at other people in ignorance (you are perpetuating it). Abuse towards them include emotional, mental and also physical besides the usual verbal and pointless discrimination.

    You make decent points, but they are rendered void by your seeming lack of real knowledge of the realities affecting those directly involved. Learn both sides of the story before you comment. If you think that is unnecessary and that the view of only one side qualifies you enough, then your statements are worth no more than the clanging of an empty vessel.

    I think more grammar lessons will do you some good. Spell check, too.

  4. ...and yet you called yourself 'islam'???

    Islam not suppose to judge right and oppress others?

    Please, spread your self-righteous point of view somewhere. It is not working...

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  6. I am with FZ over this issue. We are of course NO ustadzas but our opinions, just like yours… is base on our upbringing, what we learn in school from our teachers and then maybe at tertiary levels, our social circles comprises of our grandparents, our parents, our families, collegues , the books that we read and and wish to absorb…. And a great many other things that develop our consciences then make our piece of mind.(@Gotmilk, is that what you mean by ‘protected community?’
    Whilst DEEN is Nasihah@ Agama itu saling menasihati! ……… as much as we want to be honest with our thinking, too often I noticed, we get labeled as ‘self righteous’ or having this’hollier than thou’ attitudes.
    No one is trying to preach anyone! We are NOT holy people here....but just trying our best to base our opinion by the Holy Book, The AlFurqan.

  7. Almost it appeared to me that certain group of people are trying hard to prove that
    'We are basically much more complicated and THEREFORE much more SOPHISTICATED than thou'
    'Not having the inclination to practice Islam BUT very PROUD OF IT.'

  8. hi there

    i am muslim and a gay female. i was routed to ur blog from marina mahathir's blog. i am an engineer, someone's daughter, sister, cousin, friend. u know how i know i am gay? i know i am queer since i was 8. i am 30 now, and believe me, i've spent years of my life alone trying to stay away from sinful gay activities while at the same time unable to have anything more meaningful than just friendships with guys. i tried. and u have no idea the kind of guilt i carry everyday, the kind of guard i have to put on to stay true to my belief, which is what u believe too. u have never experienced this, so please, dont belittle my struggle by saying that homosexuality is a disease. u wont survive a day pretending to be homo even if u want to. if u cant trust others with what they do with their personal life (gay or otherwise, remember, straight ppl commit zina everyday i dont see them being shamed like homos do), trust that i am gay and i do try very hard to be muslim at the same time. please, cant we all be adults abt this and respect each other that we are different? if i have a choice i rather not be gay but it is not a choice (as much as u wont believe this) and it is something that i have to live with everyday.

    if u cant understand my plight, all i ask is a little emphaty. and it doesnt mean u are encouraging ppl to be/or stay gay. they know what's right and wrong according to what they believe. everyone fights their own war, everyday.

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  11. Dear zlkhmd,

    1. Sorry for the late comment. I have been pretty busy with work and family.

    2. I have been involved in numerous AIDS related programs both in Malaysia and abroad. I know you do not believe me when I say this but I have met many good and productive people like yourself throughout my life.

    3. I was in the states when American Psychiatric Association dropped Homosexuality as being a mental disorder. I know what went on behind the scene that led to this event. However I am not here to discuss on that issue nor am I trying to judge you. I am just trying to put things into perspective.

    4. As i wrote in my article, if you want to do whatever you want to do in your own private property, then that is your right and let Allah SWT judge us all. That is your liberty.

    5. However when you try to force your views on others (outside of your property) and doing it in a public forum, you are encroaching on the majority rights. When an individual is in his own property, he/she is the King. When the individual is interacting with his/her environment, he/she must think about the good of the community as a whole and not just him/herself. I oppose the Seksualiti Merdeka program on that basis.

    6. On the issue of homosexuality being a behavioural disease, this is what I have gather from my long experience interacting with lesbian and homosexuals group when I was involved in AIDS related programs.

    For every person who says he/she is proud to be homosexuals, there are those silent majorities who really want to change. There are programs and support group available. In the US, these support groups and programs are not allowed much media coverage due to the homosexual activism that has been going on since the 70s.